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ljamal 
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 Posted: 30 June 2003 at 9:08am |
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Turn off your javascript and surf your usual web site, you'll be surprise at the number that still function.
When I am designing a site, unless absolutely necessary, Javascript usuage is minimal and when used it is usually just bells and whistles.
I guarantee that for every site you name that doesn't work without Javascript, there I can name 5 that do.
As a programmer, I find it hard to beleive that any programmer, even in a fixed environment, would depend open something that the user can (and does) disable on a whim.
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MorningZ
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 9:16am |
while i'm sure you'd be able to "name 5 that work to one that doesn't", it all really comes down to a matter of programming style
Most of my code depends on certain things, sometimes Javascript is required for something to work, i can live with the minimal number of people who for some reason have "javascript turned off"....
maybe i'm living in a tunnel or something, but my main web site has 27,000+ signups, and i have no complaints of something not working or what not because a window wouldn't popup or a mousover wouldn't work or a field was disabled/enabled via javascript....
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ljamal
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 9:39am |
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If I can name 5 to 1 then that's hardly half the web as you stated.
While it does come down to coding preference, when it comes down to needing something to work regardless of the environment, you are better off not using something that the user can disable.
When it comes to data verification on form submission, do you rely on Javascript or do you use server side scripting or both? Why?
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Gary
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 9:44am |
I guess that (for me anyway) it depends on the project. Sometimes client-side, sometimes server-side, but mostly both.
I am lucky enough to work in a 'controlled environment' and only have to worry about IE (ok, so that makes me lazy, stupid, etc !!!). If one of my apps relies upon JS and a user has disabled JS, then we just tell them to comply with the company standarad and enable it.
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ljamal
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 9:56am |
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What does an app do that would cause it to not function correctly if Javascript is disabled? Try as I may, I haven't been able to think of a scenario where Javascript is absolutely necessary.
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MorningZ
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 10:28am |
my apologies, my apoligizes.. didnt realize someone would take "half" so literally..
as for data verification... client-side for those who support it so that it'll save a trip to the server (and give "real time" validation), but ALWAYS server side to catch all situations
maybe seems like "much"?.. but as said above.. programming preferences.... which i believe was the "spirit of this thread"
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Gary
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 10:32am |
Absolutely Morningz - I wasn't necessarily looking for THE answer, but just wanted to get some ideas and opinions.
The beauty (or sometimes pain in the arse) with this industry is that there is rarely one single right way of doing things. There is more than 1 way to skin a cat !!!
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MorningZ
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Posted: 30 June 2003 at 11:12am |
 ljamal wrote:
What does an app do that would cause it to not function correctly if Javascript is disabled? Try as I may, I haven't been able to think of a scenario where Javascript is absolutely necessary. |
what is "absolutely necessary" anyways? any person who picked up and read "Learn ASP in 10 Minutes" can make a form, submit it to the database and let Database column definitions/rules control the data
but using something like Client Side script is all about improving the visitor's experience on the site..... and (at work) making the application more user friendly for non-internet types (javascript to validate, help, show immediately on the browser), or on my personal stuff using javascript to make the site more "wow" than all my competition sites, i think spending the time, and maybe even requiring javascript be turned on, to code with client and server script going is a good thing.....
besides, i take it since you don't code against anything that someone can turn off, how do you handle someone having their IE security set to max?? this setting stops all cookies, which also stops session from working properly
i am just trying to chime in that there is no way in hell one is going to be able to code a page that satisfies every browser, every platform, every setting... you'd NEVER get any work done, lol
look! even this forum software: http://www.morningz.com/images/temp/javascript_off.jpg
at some point, a programmer/developer has to draw the line on requirements.... you'll be way behind the curve if you don't
my 2 cents....
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