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elongman
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Joined: 30 October 2005
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Topic: Love the forums, angry about Google Ads Posted: 30 October 2005 at 4:58pm |
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I support a handful of clients who have been using the WebWiz forums
for years. One in particular runs a very popular board that has
over 30,000 posts and 1200 (very active) members.
We upgraded her board to V7.95 last night and we were surprised to see
that the board was now showing Google Ads at the top and bottom of the
page, undoubtedly benefiting only Mr. Corkhill. This new
"feature" was not publicized anywhere that I can find...it's certainly
not listed in the Revision Log (beyond a vague reference to "new ads
file") or in the list of new features in the new version.
More appropriate might be a large red sign: WARNING! WEB WIZ FORUMS NOW
REQUIRES MORE THAN JUST LEAVING OUR LINK INTACT! YOU MUST DISPLAY
ADS FOR US ON YOUR SITE IN ORDER TO USE OUR SOFTWARE WITHOUT PAYING A
LICENSING FEE!
It's one thing to give the software away as linkware and require that
we leave a link to WWG at the bottom of the page. I don't mind
doing that, in fact I'm happy to offer up the Google juice because it's
a well written piece of software.
But dropping in Google Ads to earn advertising revenue from other
people's websites is going too far, particularly when the only way to
(legally) get rid of it is to pay an "ad/link removal fee". This
is too drastic a change in the licensing model to be "slipstreamed"
in.
Effectively, this amounts to hijacking revenue generating space on a
website that's not under your control, and to do it with no advance
notice was a bad, bad idea.
If you made it optional ("Enable Google Ads if you'd like to have your
site benefit the developer of the forums") that would be a different
matter, but this is just wrong. If you had properly communicated
in the documentation what the change was, that would have been more
acceptable. I don't appreciate being surprised by it, nor do I
appreciate you changing the rules of engagement without any real
notification.
My $0.02, for whatever it's worth.
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WebWiz-Bruce
Admin Group
Web Wiz Developer
Joined: 03 September 2001
Location: Bournemouth
Status: Offline
Points: 9844
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Posted: 31 October 2005 at 9:07am |
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As the site is now taking up well over 40 hours a week of my time
I need to make enough money from it to cover my time and earn enough
money for myself and my family.
At the moment I am over 30,000 USD in debit, living in a council flat
(apartment) on a dodgy council estate with my partner and 6 your old
kid. I don't even have a phone or Internet at home, but luckily my
friend owns an audio manufacturing company which has office space above
one of his warehouses which he lets me have for free in return for
doing some web site work for him each month.
This means that as this is a full-time job I need it to pay enough
money to live.
The present Google ads in Web Wiz Forums are a trial to see if
advertising would work, with maybe an aim to have ads servered from Web
Wiz Guide and people paying us direct to advertise. But at the moment
with a 0.01% click rate it's not even enough to buy a Big Mac meal each
day, so this idea will probably be dropped.
The other option at present is to charge money for the software, but I
don't really want to do this, so other means of revenue need to be
looked at.
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elongman
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Joined: 30 October 2005
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Posted: 31 October 2005 at 10:52am |
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I appreciate your situation, and the openness with which you've shared it.
What frosted me about the Google Ads is not so much the fact that they
were in there -- I respect your desire to be compensated for your hard
work -- it's that it came as a surprise. Admittedly, I'm not a
frequent visitor on the support forums at WWG (testament to the basic
stability of the software), so perhaps I missed some long discussion
about this, but I doubt it.
There are A LOT of sites running this software (Google shows 4.3
million hits on the phrase "Powered by Web Wiz Forums" -- don't know
how many actual sites that corresponds to, but it's more than a couple)
-- use the community to your advantage.
I'll bet there are a lot of capable developers who would assist with
development work (if you're at all interested in sharing the load), and
I suspect that at least some of your users would be willing to pay a
"support" fee annually or something like that to get advanced features
or more access to suggest changes, or something.
If you ask, I suspect that the community of users will help find a way
to create revenue around this thing so that it won't go away. In
the light of day, more creative solutions may come up than you would
ever have imagined. Hey, if vBulletin can support an entire
business around their product at $160 (or $85/year), why not Web Wiz
Forums?
Again, thanks for your candid response.
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WebWiz-Bruce
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Web Wiz Developer
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Posted: 31 October 2005 at 10:55am |
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In light of your response I will update the new features page to mention the Google ads as a new feature.
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elongman
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Joined: 30 October 2005
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Posted: 31 October 2005 at 12:39pm |
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Thanks, Bruce.
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dfrancis
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Joined: 16 March 2005
Location: United States
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Posted: 01 November 2005 at 4:59am |
I'm not sure I understand, is the ad words block being inserted into other forums? Is this intended to remain on registered versions?
(I have not upgraded from 7.92 yet and am curious.)
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WebWiz-Bruce
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Web Wiz Developer
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Posted: 01 November 2005 at 7:41am |
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The free linkware version now also has Google Ads intergrated into it.
These are removed by purchasing the link removal key, which has been
renamed to Ad/Link Removal Key.
At the moment it is only a test to see if it's viable, but I am
thinking about changing it so that the free version has ads in it at
the bottom and/or top, with the ads comming from this site. Then if
companies want to advertise within the software they can purchase
advertising directly from Web Wiz Guide,
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JCH2
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Joined: 04 February 2005
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Points: 129
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Posted: 01 November 2005 at 9:19am |
I have to be honest - I detest adware of any kind. It's bad enough that the average half hour of news on TV amounts to 20-21 minutes of actual news. I don't buy any software that uses streamed ads in its shareware or demonstration versions. I advise all clients to follow the same policy.
I do however appreciate that I was able to FULLY test the forum software before I purchased it shortly after, and this was a selling point for my following purchase.
I recommend ads be positioned so they do not interrupt styling of a forum, or at least minimize their impact. And be aware that the adware approach might actually decrease sales. It would have made me think twice.
Minimizing ads table height might be a start (even the one at the top of your forum, for it has excess blank space inside of it and around it.) Or prehaps placing it at the bottom of the page.
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