Start at the very beginning..
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Category: General Discussion
Forum Name: Database Discussion
Forum Description: Discussion and chat on database related topics.
URL: https://forums.webwiz.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=21724
Printed Date: 29 March 2026 at 6:28pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.08 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Start at the very beginning..
Posted By: westwight
Subject: Start at the very beginning..
Date Posted: 25 October 2006 at 9:56pm
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Hi
I'm happily using reg versions of Webwiz apps but I want to start a new project that will involve me in a whole new level of asp (and pain probably!)
I want to set up a registration and results service for the triathlon that we run every year. As we're a charity we obviously have no money so I'm left to stumble around in the dark trying to make sense of it all. Actually I might be able to find some money if I run out of brain-power but I'll worry about that later!
Firstly I'd like an entry form giving name, address, email, projected times etc. Clicking enter would update the database and transfer the user, with those details, to our credit card processor. Ideally it should also generate an email to the user but I suspect I can just utilise the existing mailform
In an admin section I'd like to be able to edit all the details. The ability to mass email would be great but not essential. Presumably I can import into our Web Wiz Mailing list? On the day I'd like multiple administrators to be able to enter times (probably 6 x 300 entries) I'd then like users able to enter their name and see their own times. They could also see the full results and category results (over 50's for example or all male) My (very basic) database question is this. Should I be separating information into different tables within Access? For example should I have all the personal details in one table (name address, predicted times etc) and all the results in another with a common field (ID?)
Or should I lump everything into one big table? We currently use a big Excel spreadsheet so it seems easy to import it into Access.
Can anyone recommend a good, very basic guide to Access design that might help me? I like to get to grips with this before I start so I understand why one approach is better rather than just blindly doing it one way or another.
Regards
Bob
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Replies:
Posted By: dpyers
Date Posted: 25 October 2006 at 11:15pm
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At the asp.net site they have a section called "By the Community, for the Community" - or words to that effect. One of the projects being developed is called "Event Monger". It's geared to work flow of a technical event, but the guy who's working on it has several posts on his blog explaining concepts, application organization, etc. They'd be worth a read. I'd stay away from MS Access here. Also check out "data base normalization" on google for ideas of how/why to use relational tables. Again, on asp.net, you might want to check out the Extended Club Site starter kit. It's an example of using the built-in roles capabilities of MS SQL 2005 to control who can update various parts of a site. Don't keep credit card info on any shared web hosting, and never email it. Use a web credit card processor like paypal with an ssl connection. They will allow you to also associate some data with the transaction. Let them take the liability for handling the money and highly personal info. ------------- 
Lead me not into temptation... I know the short cut, follow me. |
Posted By: westwight
Date Posted: 25 October 2006 at 11:49pm
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Don, thanks very much for the prompt reply. I looked up all the suggested resources but I think I'll read them tomorrow because it's too late for lucid thought tonight.
One thing, I've barely got my head around ASP and you're talking about ASP.NET! Just kill me now!
 Bob
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Posted By: dpyers
Date Posted: 26 October 2006 at 1:19am
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lol - The event Monger is still in development, but the blog entries cover basic concepts that would need to be addressed by this type of app. The Extended Club Site was more of an afterthought than anything else. Roles for a MSSQL 2005 DB are defined by VS2005 but I believe there are classic asp ways of getting to them. Never done it in classic asp though.
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Lead me not into temptation... I know the short cut, follow me. |
Posted By: westwight
Date Posted: 29 October 2006 at 10:23pm
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OK... beginning to get a better idea of this stuff.
But I've got another basic question. The database will be used sporadically over the next twelve months (say 250 competitors entering) then the same number will look up their results, possibly more than once I suppose.
On event-day we could, but don't have to, have more than one person entering times into the results (6 numbers per competitor, say 1500 entries over three hours)
All the credit card stuff already gets handled offsite by a pukka provider and we don't keep/send cc info.
All that said, would you still recommend avoiding Access? I just feel intimidated by MSSQL - even though I don't know why!
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Posted By: dpyers
Date Posted: 30 October 2006 at 1:56am
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It's not a performance issue in this case as much as it's a reliability issue. Access just like to hiccup. Basically, each user gets a copy of the db loaded into memory for their use. A .ldb is created in the same directory as the .mdb file and tracks who's doing what. Periodically, the users copy is synced back to the original .mdb file. Problems occur sometimes when users are trying to sync back to the same page space on the db, or if iis or the web server app pool resets or is restarted. I get really hesitant to use access for a mission critical app which is what this sounds like - it has to work on the day of the event. Personally, I use access db's but only for non-critical things - like logging mail from a contact form, or doing usage tracking. If it gets hosed, my primary app still works. As you're comfortable with it, you may want to develop the app with access and then convert the db to mssql later on. The SQL is generally the same. Avoid autonumber fields and use your own numbering - makes conversion simpler. -------------
Lead me not into temptation... I know the short cut, follow me. |