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wistex 
Mod Builder Group
Joined: 30 August 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 877
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 Posted: 13 April 2006 at 3:22am |
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djlurchg
Groupie
Joined: 31 March 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 40
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 8:31am |
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All this talk about how the intermediary flash popup being a good thing...I noticed that when you log on it takes you to an intermediary HTML page that employs a meta-refresh. A slow meta-refresh at that BTW. Some popular forum players use intermediary pages for various purposes.
Also, I noticed that VBB and phpBB use no intermediary page or popup. They just load the page. Those are forums that can handle searching 200,000 posts without delays.
They use a MySQL or SQL Server backend. WWF can use those or Access. Access really shouldn't be any slower. If it does get to slower, then the site admin really shouldn't be using Access for their backend anyway because they are probably exceeding the 10 concurrent connections limit and are being throttled by the Access limiter.
I'm just imagining what happens to the 5-10% of web surfers that don't have flash installed when they use WWF. Will they be prompted to download the evil Flash just to see a forum popup?
borg, I know you're frustrated with the gif animation issue, but is the search delay that much? Just wondering. If you say yes, then give me a timing or two and I'll be happy to let it rest.
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WebWiz-Bruce
Admin Group
Web Wiz Developer
Joined: 03 September 2001
Location: Bournemouth
Status: Offline
Points: 9844
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 9:46am |
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Searches with 200,000 posts in tests take less than 1 second to perform, but this is with SQL Server running under localhost with no other load on the server.
In the real world this can take longer if the server is; located away from the web server and there is heavy network load; the network is generally slow; the database or web server server is under heavy load; etc.
All these issues can not be controlled by the forum engine, which is very fast. The progress bar, that most people like, in these uncontrolled circumstances is very useful.
Take an issue that was reported to me only yesterday with a site hosted by readyhosting.com. Readhosting have recently upgraded their SQL server, but network speed between web server and SQL Server is awful, meaning that the search now takes 20 seconds to run instead of it's previous 1 second or less.
In these circumstances the progress bar is very useful, for those on faster servers, the progress bar will not course any performance issues and will only briefly display in the users browser if at all.
The intermediate page to let the user know they are logged in is just a nice way of informing the user that they have successfully logged in, or not if a cookie or session error has occurred. The previous file does all the work, but until the response is sent to the client browser there is no way to tell if the client browser is having issues with cookies or sessions, so the page is used as a round robin response to test this.
This is probably better than just hoping, like in other forums, that the client browser has handled cookies and session correctly for login, only for the user to be puzzled why they are not logged in if an issue occurs.
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djlurchg
Groupie
Joined: 31 March 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 40
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 5:56pm |
 This is probably better than just hoping, like in other forums, that
the client browser has handled cookies and session correctly for login,
only for the user to be puzzled why they are not logged in if an issue
occurs. |
You're questioning VBBs and phpBBs implementation? They are the standard by which all others are measured.
| Take an issue that was reported to me only yesterday with a site hosted
by readyhosting.com. Readhosting have recently upgraded their SQL
server, but network speed between web server and SQL Server is awful,
meaning that the search now takes 20 seconds to run instead of it's
previous 1 second or less. |
So now you're responsible for your users running the software on a terrible host? What you are talking about is a hosting issue, not a software issue. If people want to host with a company that provides such terrible service, that's their perogative. Let me ask again, what about the 5%-10% of users that don't have flash installed?
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WebWiz-Bruce
Admin Group
Web Wiz Developer
Joined: 03 September 2001
Location: Bournemouth
Status: Offline
Points: 9844
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 6:25pm |
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Flash is used because it was the only option as IE will not animate GIF's after the submit button is clicked, as I have already explained.
I'm sorry to the 5% of people may not have Flash installed, but I believe the 2 hours of writing 3 pages of replies explaining all the reasoning covers pretty much everything.
We now know why it has been done how it is, we know allot of people quite like the feature, and we know you don't like it. Do we really need to keep going over it?
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djlurchg
Groupie
Joined: 31 March 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 40
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 6:37pm |
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Nope.
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wistex
Mod Builder Group
Joined: 30 August 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 877
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 7:56pm |
That's why you have access to the source code, mate. Modify at will.  There are some things in the 7.x version that I did not like the way Borg implemented it, so for the ones that mattered to me enough to do something about it, I changed it. I have yet to find a forum package (or any software or script for that matter) that does everything like I want it to. WWF is the best ASP forums around and secure to boot. It makes an excellent base upon which to build your website. Especially since its commented so well.
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Mikey
Senior Member
1979
Joined: 06 October 2003
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 839
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Posted: 13 April 2006 at 9:17pm |
Lock this topic, as this has been fully discussed now. 
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Handyman man?
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Flash: Why?
Lol Wistex your one of the WWF members that make me feel sane 
